Open Discussion - Front solid axle conversion

[p@55w0rd]

OK this is some time out for me but I would like to start planning and maybe along the way someone else may do it and share the pain. I know they offer kits for the Kj (Liberty) so there must be some resources out there. What would be needed? What type of setup would be best (4 link?) What would be the best donor axle? What about brakes? What about swapping the rear also to get a matched pair? Custom drive shafts? custom computer programming? I know Tymac (who no longer owns an XK) was seriously considering this. Any input, thoughts, or laughter?

[christiang26]

With the qt2 is possible, here in venezuela a guy used a wj dana 30 driveshaft but he didnt explained to much about the mod and how it was made but he said that the only issue with the computer was the abs light glowing in the dash but he solved it using wj abs sensors in the front.

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[p@55w0rd]

Thanks for the input! A WJ axle (D30) can handle up to 33" with some minor mods. I suppose you could upgrade to a "super" 30 but maybe a D44 would be a better starting point?

[07JeepXK]

I would go with a JK Dana 44 if your going to invest the money into a solid axle. That way you can still keep the 5 on 5 bolt pattern, you can run 35's or larger without an issue and most likely not have an issue with the abs wheel speed sensors

[criket]

^ he is right on the JK 44. If you build a JK 44 right, it can be stronger than a standard Dana 60 and not really costs much more. Go look at some of the mud trucks. Some of those guys use a built Dana 44 instead of goign 60's or Rockwells. They seem to do fine but it all comes down to how you wheel, not what you wheel.

If I ever do an SAS, I'd like to get the aftermarket JK 44 (I think from Currie or Dynatrac, I can't remember)

[JustinS]

Here are a couple of KJ SFA swaps:

http://www.lostjeeps.com/forum/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?f=73&t=64692

This one will be insane once done: http://www.lostjeeps.com/forum/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?f=73&t=74050

And here is a listing of all SFA Liberty builds: http://www.lostjeeps.com/forum/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?f=73&t=39256

[p@55w0rd]

The second link above for the KK is awesome! I will be watching that build with great interest...

[BonesWK]

I know this guy personally - http://www.lostjeeps.com/forum/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?t=32570

Great rig, but now that he sold it its being beat to the ground. Shame.

[06JeepXKHEMI]

Question: Say you do SAS with a D44, done up right and run 35s, what gears would you put in and how would you regear the rear axle?!? Also assuming someone as myself has QDII which would render itself useless, how would you get the computer to act right when wheeling?

[Matt]

Id put a D44 in the rear as well.

Us QDII guys would be in trouble. A 2010 hemi QTII would be ideal..

[06JeepXKHEMI]

From what Ive seen a good D44 built right, which it should be is around 1500-2k??? so times that by 2?? Is there anyway to keep the rear axle? Or swap out the 12 bolt for a 10 bolt and lock it. but then still no gears..?? Then what about Tcase?? And computer? Seems like 10K+ easily..

[Matt]

Find a wrecked 2wd xk with a d44 rear and use that. Infinitely more gearing/carrier options.

Tcase and trans are fine. Computer is fine (for qti and qtii)

Yes it will be a very expensive build.... youre not gonna SAS a commander for cheap. Done smart, I think it would be under 10k though.

Consider superlift+rcv axles+gears = $6ish... and thats theoretical since we can't regear... so its not completely unreasonable.

[Matt]

Hmmmmm, would probably have to disable the stability control due to steering angle differences (like putting a wk rack in an xk lol)

[06JeepXKHEMI]

So you'd be able to use the tcase we have and transmission, and swap out a QTII or QTI computer? Im just trying to justify, besides the obvious gain in flexing the front and coolness factor, of this swap compared to modified SL w/RCVs.. I have to imagine gears will come sooner than later, but running 33s proves to be alright..

[Matt]

Dont bet on having a lot of gear options. Our axles had a limited run and I doubt will see any significant aftermarket support.

SAS will give us gearing options, the necessary amount of lift to properly run 35s and the ability to take these vehicles to the next level offroad. A modified superlift on 35s isnt going to do much more than a modified superlift on 33-34s. In both cases our front suspension travel sucks.

Not to mention the cost of replacing our crappy steering racks all the time lol.

I think QDII guys would need to swap in a QTII computer. Not sure how we'd solve the stability control issue but id imagine the first person to do this could get AEV on board to help. .. their module with the proper setting will do it

[Matt]

With all that said ill probably never SAS my xk..... theres just not enough wheeling around me to make use of it. I can have a modified superlift installed in a weekend and be done with it.

If I lived out West, it'd be in my crosshairs.

[06JeepXKHEMI]

So essentially, wouldnt a 2wd XK be ideal?? I see your point on the advantages now, I guess if you bout axles and built them over time and addressed SC and computer issues the swap wouldnt be as bad.. Assuming a 8" lift and long arms would be the set up..?

[Matt]

No with 2wd you'd need a tcase and the controls. Might as well get them from factory. :)

Edit: and just remembered you wouldnt be able to use 4 low due to programming. The drivetrain will go into limp mode. So QTII is definitely what you'd want for this swap. Id stay far away from 2wd.

And yeah... 8" with 35s would be nice

[06JeepXKHEMI]

As sick as it may be, just waaaay to much! A modified SL and 33-34s is all thats in my future, Ill get a TJ or ideally an LJ for something more extreme, Id die for an LJ, probably my favorite Jeeps, besides mine of course..

[JustinS]

I would think switching to a manual transfer case would be required....wouldn't be too hard either, just need to figure out where the handles would come up through the center console.

[Matt]

Regardless you're going to put the vehicle in limp mode when you shift into 4-low. Unless the programming becomes available (its not now) you'd need QDII or QTII if you want 4 low capabilities.

Theres a long thread on here where myself and another member were trying to think of ways to trick the computer so his NV245 swap would work. He did the swap and could shift into 4 low, but the computer puts the trans in limp mode after he starts moving.

[TrialByFire]

What if an Eaton eLocker is compatible with the SA? QDII would be fully compatible, no? My read of the manual suggests that the computer outputs a 0 - 5V analog signal to control the power transfer ratio bewtween th L & R. With the ABS sensors you should be good to go.

[p@55w0rd]

Question: Say you do SAS with a D44, done up right and run 35s, what gears would you put in and how would you regear the rear axle?!? Also assuming someone as myself has QDII which would render itself useless, how would you get the computer to act right when wheeling?

I would put a D44 or better in the rear.

[p@55w0rd]

Find a wrecked 2wd xk with a d44 rear and use that. Infinitely more gearing/carrier options.

Tcase and trans are fine. Computer is fine (for qti and qtii)

Yes it will be a very expensive build.... youre not gonna SAS a commander for cheap. Done smart, I think it would be under 10k though.

Consider superlift+rcv axles+gears = $6ish... and thats theoretical since we can't regear... so its not completely unreasonable.

When I added up the cost to build MY XK up with a super lift and all the extras I came to 5K and it still was IFS. This is one of the reasons I went out an bought a 2000 Grand Cherokee with a SFA. When I beat the crap out of this and am ready for a change I will sell the WJ and start the buildup on the XK. But in the mean time I am going to start looking for the axles. A D44 front and back would allow you to lock and gear how every you wanted. An additional item on my wish list is a long arm suspension (after a gas tank relocation). This would take the XK to a completely different level.

[p@55w0rd]

As sick as it may be, just waaaay to much! A modified SL and 33-34s is all thats in my future, Ill get a TJ or ideally an LJ for something more extreme, Id die for an LJ, probably my favorite Jeeps, besides mine of course..

OK even with a Superlift you are limiting your range of travel. A solid axle has WAY more movement and will keep your wheels planted for traction. Look at the flex you get when you remove your rear anti-sway. Granted you could do a TJ, JK, or even a JKU, but you will never get the same creature comforts you get in your XK. Personally I think 10K is a bit high (maybe if you pay someone to do everything?). I believe it would be more in the $7 range if you take you time and find deals on the axles and do the work yourself.

[Matt]

What if an Eaton eLocker is compatible with the SA? QDII would be fully compatible, no? My read of the manual suggests that the computer outputs a 0 - 5V analog signal to control the power transfer ratio bewtween th L & R. With the ABS sensors you should be good to go.

There's a few issues with trying to run an eLocker with QDII controls:

1) The eLocker solenoid would have to be the same specs or the FDCM will throw codes. It's possible that the solenoid is close enough.. but it would have to be looked into.

2) It looks like the FDCM controls the QDII with voltage pulses, not steady voltage (but not PWM either). Not sure exactly why they do this, but its what I gathered by reading the solenoid troubleshooting steps in the FSM. Pulsing voltage to the QDII solenoid might be OK for how the ergodisc functions since the solenoid basically varies a valve for variable torque control... but this may be an issue with the elocker since it'll be on/off/on/off/on/off etc.

3) The QDII ergodisc provides "variable" torque, UP to full lock. Remember that this system allows some slippage as its being activated (probably why its a pulsing signal and not constant voltage... maybe the pulses get closer together for full lock..). So when you lose traction and the FDCM sends a pulse to the diff, no big deal if you're on pavement since it just acts like an LS rear. But have an elocker in there and lose traction for a second and you're gonna go to instant full lock on the street which is not a good thing.

4) I'm not sure if the elocker is designed to be activated with the drivetrain in action. Seems like a lot of potential wear/tear using it in a QDII application. Normally lockers are engaged before entering an obstacle, not in the process of losing traction.

5) (more so an opinion here) I'd want to be able to control my e-lockers offroad.

[07JeepXK]

I would put a D44 or better in the rear.

You do realize that swapping a Dana 44 in the rear would be pointless and a waste of money right. Our axles have a ring gear of 8.25 and a Dana 44 has a ring gear of 8.50

Well unless the Dana 44 was given to you for free!

[criket]

You do realize that swapping a Dana 44 in the rear would be pointless and a waste of money right. Our axles have a ring gear of 8.25 and a Dana 44 has a ring gear of 8.50

Well unless the Dana 44 was given to you for free!

I would prob do a pair of Dynatrac axles that are for a JK, sort of like you mention earlier. THe Dynatracs have upgradable components so it should be just as strong as anything else.

But you are right about the ring gear size. Actually, by the time I would have a built Dynatrac 44, I could get a built 9 from Currie. Or even better, a built and shaved 14 bolt (prob the cheaper option)

[Matt]

A D44 rear isn't pointless if you come across a Rubi axle set. Sure it's only a slightly larger ring gear, but with infinitely more gear/carrier options than our 8.25.

Then again, if you're doing a build like this, might as well get something that can take the weight of a XK with the torque of a 5.7L in 4low....I'm still in an east-coast mindset and have to remind myself of some of the fun the west-cost guys have lol

[p@55w0rd]

You do realize that swapping a Dana 44 in the rear would be pointless and a waste of money right. Our axles have a ring gear of 8.25 and a Dana 44 has a ring gear of 8.50

Well unless the Dana 44 was given to you for free!

No I don't. Why? Explain further? A D44 in the front and rear would be an awesome set up! This would allow your choice of gearing and lockers with the ability to handle 35" tires all day long.

[JustinS]

You do realize that swapping a Dana 44 in the rear would be pointless and a waste of money right. Our axles have a ring gear of 8.25 and a Dana 44 has a ring gear of 8.50

Well unless the Dana 44 was given to you for free!

If you don't want to bolt in a Dana44 rear from a 2wd XK, and are going to upgrade....a Ford 8.8 would definitely be next on my list.

[07JeepXK]

Yeah ford 8.8 would be nice but wouldn't work so well with our computers

[JustinS]

QTII commanders utilize a separate controller for the transmission/transfer-case right? Wonder what would it involve to eliminate all 4x4 function from it for full manual control of transfer-case.

There have been several SAS dakotas...wonder what they are doing.

[JustinS]

It looks like the jk guys that swap to a hemi use the 545rfe and it bolts to the tcase that comes in the manual jk...they use 2wd motor/trans combos.

[Matt]

To get full manual tcase in a xk/wk you need to do 2 additional things
1- match the nv245 gear reduction or reprogram the computer for the new gear reduction
2- have a switch that tells the computer what gear you're in

It definitely adds significant complexity to doing this swap if you're not satisfied with the nv245. Lol probably deserving of its own thread too

[Matt]

I swapped a manual tcase into my Explorer back in the day. Didn't need to do anything special though because the computer didn't care, i just had the wrong speed displayed on my dash.

The xk/wk platform is a completely different beast due to the advanced traction control system that monitors each wheel speed relative to trans speed and even relative to steering wheel position.

[06JeepXKHEMI]

As I said a bunch of times before if I struck millions I'd do this but you look at trialbyfire and other heavily modded XKs and there really isn't much they Can't do.. I know people mention wheeling with the luxury of our rigs with the capabilities of SFA but to be honest I'd rather get another trail rig if at all to have fun with, you start swapping drivetrains and the luxuries of our XKs are almost gone minus the interior's.. I hope someone does it cause it'd sure be cool just not realistic for me right now.. Plus I love seeing look on people's faces when my IFS Jeep does what it does with minor upgrades, that to me is what makes wheeling an XK fun..

Sent from my SGH-T999 using Tapatalk 2

[JustinS]

To get full manual tcase in a xk/wk you need to do 2 additional things
1- match the nv245 gear reduction or reprogram the computer for the new gear reduction
2- have a switch that tells the computer what gear you're in

It definitely adds significant complexity to doing this swap if you're not satisfied with the nv245. Lol probably deserving of its own thread too
Do the 2wd xk's have traction control? I wonder if it would be as simple as swapping in a 2wd ecu/pcm when you do a sfa swap to overcome those issues.

[Matt]

Do the 2wd xk's have traction control? I wonder if it would be as simple as swapping in a 2wd ecu/pcm when you do a sfa swap to overcome those issues.

Yes they still have the ESP, however the front is controlled a bit different since there's no power to the front wheels. We'd still have the same issue since all of the modules talk to each other, so if the wheel speeds don't match what the computer thinks they should based on engine/trans RPM, the vehicle will go into limp mode and be stuck in 2nd gear.

[07JeepXK]

Can't wait to get my front diff wired up. This beast won't need a solid axle.

[06JeepXKHEMI]

I just came across this.. This may change a few things if these are legit! http://4xguard.com/commander-2006-2010/differential-gears.html#

[07JeepXK]

Yeah we had a poll not that long ago asking what ratio you would prefer. I'd take either 4.10's or 4.56's. 4.10's would go nice with the rubicon stickers I'm about to get for my hood lol

[criket]

Why can't you install a divorced tcase (whatever tcase you want) and put the ring gear from the hub where the wheel speed senors read from, put those ring gears on the short driveshaft between the trans and tcase, and move ALL wheel speed sensors to a bracket that will read off of the ring gear on the short driveshaft?

That way, you can have any tcase you want and any gears you want and the computer will still be reading from an original ring gear for the wheel speed sensor so no codes will be thrown.

Making sense?

[06JeepXKHEMI]

Apparently, Arrington Motorsports has the ability to shut off wheel speed sensors from the ECU, Ive been reading TJ HEMI swaps as they use different Tcases to make their applications work so that technology is out there.. Now whether the 4WD system will still work properly is another thing..

[Matt]

Why can't you install a divorced tcase (whatever tcase you want) and put the ring gear from the hub where the wheel speed senors read from, put those ring gears on the short driveshaft between the trans and tcase, and move ALL wheel speed sensors to a bracket that will read off of the ring gear on the short driveshaft?

That way, you can have any tcase you want and any gears you want and the computer will still be reading from an original ring gear for the wheel speed sensor so no codes will be thrown.

Making sense?

That'll work until you turn the wheel and ESP kicks in because it expects to see different wheel speeds

[thance]

That'll work until you turn the wheel and ESP kicks in because it expects to see different wheel speeds

Hmmm..... Does it actually expect to see different wheel speeds, or just accept enough variability to allow for it?

[07JeepXK]

That'll work until you turn the wheel and ESP kicks in because it expects to see different wheel speeds

Turn ESP off. You wouldn't want ESP working with a SFA anyways

[JustinS]

Lots of jk hemi guys appear to use an ESP kill switch....but it also kills abs and cruise control.

[criket]

That'll work until you turn the wheel and ESP kicks in because it expects to see different wheel speeds

This is true


Turn ESP off. You wouldn't want ESP working with a SFA anyways

This is also true in which I would kill ESP. I'd prob install a kill switch or see if pulling the fuse would work. Of course I'd cross that bridge when I got there.

[Matt]

Hmmm..... Does it actually expect to see different wheel speeds, or just accept enough variability to allow for it?

It actually expects to see different wheel speeds. It's why the EGR is needed with the SL (the knuckles change the steering angle) and why putting a WK rack in an XK causes the ESP to activate when turning.


Turn ESP off. You wouldn't want ESP working with a SFA anyways

You can't disable that feature without killing ABS and CC (as Justin mentioned). Long pressing the button still keeps the BTC active.

[p@55w0rd]

I just came across this.. This may change a few things if these are legit! http://4xguard.com/commander-2006-2010/differential-gears.html#

Just an FYI I called and talked at length with these guys and the gears are not going to happen in the near future. It appears that the cost to get a small run of these gears made would put the price in the $1500-2000 range. A bit outside of what mere mortals would be willing to pay.

[p@55w0rd]

Can't wait to get my front diff wired up. This beast won't need a solid axle.

Yes! Please let us know how this works out. Cool project.

[07JeepXK]

I'm just trying to locate the harness that plugs into the differential. If I can't get my hands on one ill just make my own.

[Gulf550]

I'm just trying to locate the harness that plugs into the differential. If I can't get my hands on one ill just make my own.

I had to order one before. I will see if I can dig up the part number for you.

[Gulf550]

P/N 56050223AD this is the "jumper" harness that plugs into the top of the front differential. Mopar refers to it as a wiring cradle. My connector broke on mine that's why I had to order a new one.

[Matt]

Well i'll be damned... I was looking for that part in the manual forever yesterday!

FYI, the 2007 parts manual lists it as P/N 56048637AA

[lekmedm]

It actually expects to see different wheel speeds. It's why the EGR is needed with the SL (the knuckles change the steering angle) and why putting a WK rack in an XK causes the ESP to activate when turning.

If the tie rod end is moved up 4 inches on the SL knuckles in relation to the wheel hub, why would the steering angle be changed? Is the steering rack relocated, too?


Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I727 using Tapatalk 2

[07JeepXK]

P/N 56050223AD this is the "jumper" harness that plugs into the top of the front differential. Mopar refers to it as a wiring cradle. My connector broke on mine that's why I had to order a new one.


Well i'll be damned... I was looking for that part in the manual forever yesterday!

FYI, the 2007 parts manual lists it as P/N 56048637AA

Nice! I'll order it tomorrow. Thanks guys

[Matt]

If the tie rod end is moved up 4 inches on the SL knuckles in relation to the wheel hub, why would the steering angle be changed? Is the steering rack relocated, too?

I'll be able to figure it out better when I have the knuckle in front of me. I expect that the length of the arm on the knuckle changes a bit... maybe the superlift knuckle has a 1/4" shorter tie rod arm to help clear wheels, which then increases how much the tires turn for a given wheel angle.

[07JeepXK]

If the tie rod end is moved up 4 inches on the SL knuckles in relation to the wheel hub, why would the steering angle be changed? Is the steering rack relocated, too?


Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I727 using Tapatalk 2

The steering rack stays in the stock location. The tie rod end moves up with the new steering knuckle like you mentioned.

[07JeepXK]

P/N 56050223AD this is the "jumper" harness that plugs into the top of the front differential. Mopar refers to it as a wiring cradle. My connector broke on mine that's why I had to order a new one.


Well i'll be damned... I was looking for that part in the manual forever yesterday!

FYI, the 2007 parts manual lists it as P/N 56048637AA

I called the dealer and ordered the part number Matt listed for the 2007. I'm hoping this is the correct part. The dealer said its listed as the cradle harness and has 3 connectors coming off of it. As long as one of the connectors clips into the front differential, ill be able to use it. Gulf550, does this sound like the correct part?

[Gulf550]

Mine only had one connector on each side. The harness length was maybe 8" long. Something doesn't seem right about it, but they might have done something different with 2007 model years. I will try climbing underneath mine today and snapping a picture of it.

[07JeepXK]

I called the dealer back and the parts guy said he will look into it. Worse case scenario he said he wil order both and when they arrive ill let him know which one I need

[Matt]

In the 2007 parts manual it's listed twice, once on the 4.7L engine wiring page and again on the 5.7L engine wiring page. Although they list the same part number on both sheets, it shows 3 connectors on the image for the 5.7L page and only 2 connectors on the 4.7L page.

In the 2006 parts manual its the same scenario with the P/N Gulf posted... except that the 5.7L engine had two other harness options.

I'm thinking in 2007 they made it a standard harness and some guys just have an extra connector hanging around. The new part number might include a cap.

[07JeepXK]

Ok. So either way ill be set cause he said he was just going to order both just in case. I'll be hacking up the harness anyway. I just need the plug with a few inches of wire.

[Holaday07 4.7]

So who is going to do it first?

I have a HP dana 30 from a JK sitting in my garage. The Dana 30 would be no problem with 33-36 inch tires. Plus the WJ dana 30 is our bolt pattern but comes with the less desireable CV axle shafts. my LP 30 on my TJ holds up fine with 35s and beadlocks. Just depends on your driving style. I see no reason a JK Rock Krawler jk long arm kit would not set up the suspension correctly since it comes with a weld in cross member for the front links. My big concern would be steering, unless some type of hydro assist could be used to take the stress off of the rack.

[07JeepXK]

The more I think about it, if I get a Hemi XK in the future I don't think I'm going to get it with QD II. It makes a solid axle conversion more difficult due to the computer programming and quite possibly not as capable as the front and rear setup I'm currently running in my Jeep.

[p@55w0rd]

So who is going to do it first?

I have a HP dana 30 from a JK sitting in my garage. The Dana 30 would be no problem with 33-36 inch tires. Plus the WJ dana 30 is our bolt pattern but comes with the less desireable CV axle shafts. my LP 30 on my TJ holds up fine with 35s and beadlocks. Just depends on your driving style. I see no reason a JK Rock Krawler jk long arm kit would not set up the suspension correctly since it comes with a weld in cross member for the front links. My big concern would be steering, unless some type of hydro assist could be used to take the stress off of the rack.


Conversion kits to turn the CV style axle to a ujoint style are available. Also certain XJ axle shafts are a direct swap. Not sure such though.
EDIT:
Anyone have any thoughts of on tying in the rack?
I wonder if one could scavenge the d30 and d44 off of a WJ? The D44a in the back would need some reinforcement because it is made with aluminum but should work. And maybe a good selection because they are cheap and have the ABS setup with disc brakes.

[Holaday07 4.7]

Conversion kits to turn the CV style axle to a ujoint style are available. Also certain XJ axle shafts are a direct swap. Not sure such though.
EDIT:
Anyone have any thoughts of on tying in the rack?
I wonder if one could scavenge the d30 and d44 off of a WJ? The D44a in the back would need some reinforcement because it is made with aluminum but should work. And maybe a good selection because they are cheap and have the ABS setup with disc brakes.

I wonder if you could swap over everything from a JK? It seems plausable. Daveys Jeeps has them and then you could eliminate the rack all together. The JK steering boxes are holding up to 37s alright.

I would avoid that 44a at all cost. just my $.02

[07JeepXK]

Now that I'm locked front and rear this jeep won't be getting a solid axle or superlift. Dont need em

[jjt250]

Now that I'm locked front and rear this jeep won't be getting a solid axle or superlift. Dont need em

I would love to see that front locker in action and see how it works. That sounds so cool. Maybe QDII guys will be able to do that some day. I'd love to be able to manually lock my diffs.

Has anyone thought about a long travel suspension? Like with longer A arms, etc, similar to a Ford Raptor? Those are like 3.5 inches wider on each side but even 2 inches could yield some pretty good gains and wouldn't it solve a lot of computer related problems vs a SAS? I mean you still wouldn't get the articulation gains of a SAS but it would probably be easier, more cost effective, and still very comfortable to drive especially if you combined it with some Icon or King coilovers. Of course your tires would stick out further so you'd need fender flares most likely but I can see that being much easier to accomplish on XKs. I don't know, I just always thought long travel suspension would be really awesome to see done on our platforms.

[valpacer]

The more I think about it, if I get a Hemi XK in the future I don't think I'm going to get it with QD II. It makes a solid axle conversion more difficult due to the computer programming and quite possibly not as capable as the front and rear setup I'm currently running in my Jeep.

The opposite. QDII vehicles disable the traction control completely in Low range, all you have to do is fool the computer that the solenoid is still there (resistor). With a QTii vehicle it will still try to brake the wheels if it determines a slip (that can be side to side or front to rear) where the QDII vehicle wont. Ie if the rear spins and the front doesnt, it will actually brake the rear wheels and vice versa. I know the Tcase should be fully locked anywy, but with enough load they will slip.

[jjt250]

The opposite. QDII vehicles disable the traction control completely in Low range, all you have to do is fool the computer that the solenoid is still there (resistor). With a QTii vehicle it will still try to brake the wheels if it determines a slip (that can be side to side or front to rear) where the QDII vehicle wont. Ie if the rear spins and the front doesnt, it will actually brake the rear wheels and vice versa. I know the Tcase should be fully locked anywy, but with enough load they will slip.

Hmmm never even thought about that. Makes sense but if you're locked, it won't matter right since the computer things your wheels are just spinning at the same speeds?

[07JeepXK]

Hmmm never even thought about that. Makes sense but if you're locked, it won't matter right since the computer things your wheels are just spinning at the same speeds?

That's what I was thinking. Right now I'm locked front and rear so the tires on both side of each axle spin the same speed. Who knows. I love my current setup. Just got to really wheel it now and see how everything works out and what I break next lol

[06JeepXKHEMI]

This is what I was thinking the other day, in the situations where you dont need to flip the switch for QDII clutches, wont the computer still want to brake whatever wheel is slipping? Could this damage the QDII diff?

[Matt]

Dave are you sure QDII disables traction control differently that QTII?

If you're in 4 low with QDII and have your front diff open, Itll probably set a DTC for front diff clutch performance. ... but thats not really a big deal.

Which gives me another thought for the QTII guys. Adam do you have a place with loose dirt or gravel that you can drive circles on with your front locker engaged? ? Wondering how your traction control system will react when it doesnt see different wheel speeds while turning (ref steering rack issue)

[Matt]

Andrew, that won't damage the QDII diff

[07JeepXK]

This is what I was thinking the other day, in the situations where you dont need to flip the switch for QDII clutches, wont the computer still want to brake whatever wheel is slipping? Could this damage the QDII diff?

Nope cause I have a switch wired up to completely disable the traction control through the abs pump fuse. So the traction control won't kick I at all. Just full power to both rear wheels and one front. Flip the locker switch and then get full power to all four wheels

[07JeepXK]

Dave are you sure QDII disables traction control differently that QTII?

If you're in 4 low with QDII and have your front diff open, Itll probably set a DTC for front diff clutch performance. ... but thats not really a big deal.

Which gives me another thought for the QTII guys. Adam do you have a place with loose dirt or gravel that you can drive circles on with your front locker engaged? ? Wondering how your traction control system will react when it doesnt see different wheel speeds while turning (ref steering rack issue)

I can probably find somewhere to test that out

[07JeepXK]

Just tested it out. 4high with front end locked making figure 8's on gravel parking lot. The traction control was fine and never kicked in. I can definitely tell when the front end is locked. You can feel it in the steering wheel

[Matt]

Thats awesome. I was trying to think of how the programming logic would work and came up with a few scenarios where equal wheel speeds wouldn't activate traction control... basically a case of "divide by zero" where I would presume the programmers would default to no traction control necessary since its an impossible scenario based on design (until you throw a locker in)

... sounds like another +1 for QTI and QTII guys who want lockers! !