ESP OFF in 4 Low

I'm bringing this discussion over hear from the other forum so hopefully someone can provide some input. This was written by 08JeepXK:


After talking with 07jeepXK on the phone we have found out that something is different about our 4-wheel low engaugement. Both have 4.7 and both have QTII his is an 07 mine an 08 but when i put mine in low range it automatically goes to full off mode (abs and traction light up). Does anyone ealse with an 08 with QTII do the same as mine? His 07 didn't do as mine did. Thanks again 07jeep XK for taking the time to call and talk to me about this

My response:


Not a problem!

Just to clarify so there is no confusion. When I put my jeep in 4 low all that illuminates is the 4WD LOW light and the traction control light. I have to manually hold down the traction control button for approx 8-10 sec for it to display ESP OFF. Now on his 2008 Commander, as soon as he puts it in 4 Low the ESP OFF light turns on. So can someone with an 08 4.7 QT II put their jeep in 4 low and see if ESP OFF illuminates on the dash like his or do you need to press on hold the traction control button like mine for it to show ESP OFF.

Also if I can get someone with an 07 4.7 like mine to do the same to make sure mine is working properly. I just got confused a few minutes ago when I was looking at my owners manual because it said once put in 4 Low the ESP automatically turnes off. Well that's not the case with my Jeep

This is interesting. I believe I read that ESP turns completely off when in 4LO or at least I thought it did with QDII. I have an 07 CRD with QDII and I think it just illuminates the 4wd light and nothing else but I'm not sure so I will see tomorrow morning what happens. I know this wasn't exactly what you're looking for but I thought it would be of some relevance. Maybe it actually does turn off but the 05-07's didn't illuminate the ESP light whereas the 08+'s did?

Quote:

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Originally Posted by 07JeepXK

Also if I can get someone with an 07 4.7 like mine to do the same to make sure mine is working properly. I just got confused a few minutes ago when I was looking at my owners manual because it said once put in 4 Low the ESP automatically turnes off. Well that's not the case with my Jeep

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My 2007 5.7L works exactly as your 4.7L.

Maybe the light was just added on in 2008. The Hemis in 06 and 07 have the MDS system just like in the 08-10 models, but they don't show on the display when MDS is active. That message came in 08. Maybe the 4 low issue is the same story?


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07JeepXK
My XK, the same as yours works the same way when put in 4Low. The 4Low light and squiggly traction control indicator comes on. To achieve full ESP Off I have to hold the button in and it shows up in the Evic.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by jjt250

This is interesting. I believe I read that ESP turns completely off when in 4LO or at least I thought it did with QDII. I have an 07 CRD with QDII and I think it just illuminates the 4wd light and nothing else but I'm not sure so I will see tomorrow morning what happens. I know this wasn't exactly what you're looking for but I thought it would be of some relevance. Maybe it actually does turn off but the 05-07's didn't illuminate the ESP light whereas the 08+'s did?

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The first thing I asked him is how many bolts are on his rear diff. I was thinking maybe he had a 4.7 QD II. But he only has a 10 both rear.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by lekmedm

My 2007 5.7L works exactly as your 4.7L.

Maybe the light was just added on in 2008. The Hemis in 06 and 07 have the MDS system just like in the 08-10 models, but they don't show on the display when MDS is active. That message came in 08. Maybe the 4 low issue is the same story?


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That's weird though because if I recall correctly, Andrews 06 Hemi QD II illuminates the ESP OFF when put in 4 Low.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by NoMatter

07JeepXK
My XK, the same as yours works the same way when put in 4Low. The 4Low light and squiggly traction control indicator comes on. To achieve full ESP Off I have to hold the button in and it shows up in the Evic.

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Awesome. Thanks. Now if we can just get someone with an 08 4.7 liter QT II to respond

Well this is very interesting! i just went out and put it 4Lo and I got the yellow light with 4Lo and squiggly lines with car symbol, I then held the ESP button and 8 seconds later ESP OFF came up in EVIC. So this makes me wonder if this whole time Ive been wheeling it, ESP has not been completely off?!? Not that its ever really affected performance cause knock on wood I havent gotten stuck but I have never felt the ESP system kick in, at all..

That's weird! I thought at Wispering Pines when you put it in 4 Low it displayed ESP OFF. I remember saying... Hmmm that's not how my system works

I know, I figured since I got the squiggly lines it meant ESP was off, but I guess not.. You saw hill climbs and muddy spots where i got thru despite my tires, the ESP never kicked in or hindered the outcome..
Really makes me wonder though how itd perform with ESP OFF completely, guess Ill have to go mudding again...

From the 2007 owner manual page 142:

Quote:

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4WD Low RangeFull Off
This is the normal operating mode for ESP in 4WD low
range. Whenever the vehicle is started in 4WD low range,
or the transfer case (if equipped) is shifted from 4WD
high range or neutral to 4WD low range, the ESP system
will be in this mode. In 4WD low range, ESP and TCS,
except for the “limited slip” feature described in the TCS
section, are turned off until the vehicle reaches a speed of
40 mph (64 km/h). At 40 mph (64 km/h), the normal ESP
stability function returns but TCS remains off. When the
vehicle speed drops below 35 mph (56 km/h), the ESP
system shuts off. ESP is off at low vehicle speeds in 4WD
low range so that it will not interfere with off-road
driving but ESP function returns to provide the stability
feature at speeds above 40 mph (64 km/h). The ESP/
TCS Indicator Light will always be illuminated in 4WD
low range when ESP is off.
NOTE: The “ESP OFF” message will display and the
audible chime will sound when the gear selector is
placed into the “P” (Park) position from any position
other than “P” (Park), and then moved out of the “P”
(Park) position. This will occur even if the message was
previously cleared

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From the 2008 owner manual page 142-3:

Quote:

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4WD Low RangeFull Off
This is the normal operating mode for ESP in 4WD low
range. Whenever the vehicle is started in 4WD low range,
or the transfer case (if equipped) is shifted from 4WD
high range or neutral to 4WD low range, the ESP system
will be in this “Full Off” mode. In 4WD low range, ESP
and TCS, except for the “limited slip” feature described
in the TCS section, are turned off until the vehicle reaches
a speed of 40 mph (64 km/h). At 40 mph (64 km/h), the
normal ESP stability function returns but TCS remains
off. When the vehicle speed drops below 35 mph (56
km/h), the ESP system shuts off. ESP is deactivated at
low vehicle speeds in 4WD low range so that it will not
interfere with off-road driving but ESP function returns
to provide the stability feature at speeds above 40 mph
(64 km/h). The 9ESP/TCS Indicator Light9 will always be
illuminated in 4WD low range when ESP is off.
NOTE: The “ESP OFF” message will display and the
audible chime will sound when the gear selector is
placed into the “P” (Park) position from any other
position, and then moved out of the “P” (Park) position.
This will occur even if the message was previously
cleared

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Yeah the owners manual for 2007 is wrong. It states whenever the vehicle is placed in 4 low the ESP is in full OFF. That is not correct. I have to press and hold down the traction control button until I hear the chime and it displays ESP OFF on the dash.

Adam I think you read it wrong, I think it says its fully off until you reach 40mph and under 35mph its fully off.. Im assuming that when you hold the button off, it will keep ESP OFF even off 40mph as if it were in either 4Hi or 4Lo

I dont think I read it wrong. Right out of the owners manual:

4WD Low RangeFull Off
This is the normal operating mode for ESP in 4WD low range. Whenever the vehicle is started in 4WD low range, or the transfer case (if equipped) is shifted from 4WD high range or neutral to 4WD low range, the ESP system will be in this mode.

The last sentence says whenever shifted from 4 HIGH to 4 LOW the ESP will be off. It even says it will chime and illuminate ESP OFF on the dash farther down the page in the manual when placed in 4 Low. Mine doesnt, 08JeepXK's does.

Ok got it, so I was the a$$ reading it wrong.. So why doesnt mine shut off ESP completely? And should I shut ESP OFF even though I havent had any issues thus far? Also, I know we've talked about this before but when its snowin out I only push the button once correct?

Quote:

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Originally Posted by 07JeepXK

Yeah the owners manual for 2007 is wrong. It states whenever the vehicle is placed in 4 low the ESP is in full OFF. That is not correct. I have to press and hold down the traction control button until I hear the chime and it displays ESP OFF on the dash.

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Right. I just double-checked, and my XK does the same as your's.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by 06JeepXKHEMI

Ok got it, so I was the a$$ reading it wrong.. So why doesnt mine shut off ESP completely? And should I shut ESP OFF even though I havent had any issues thus far? Also, I know we've talked about this before but when its snowin out I only push the button once correct?

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I think you should try it next time with ESP OFF and see what you like better. Everyone has their own preference. When driving on the road in 4 High in the snow just push the traction control button once.

So I finally remembered to check this out and it's the same deal as O7JeepXk's and 06JeepXKHEMI's. Mine is an 07 WK CRD with QDII, also.

In 4Low:
Attachment 1672

In 4Low after holding the ESP button down:
Attachment 1673

So it must be something new in 08+ Would still like to hear from someone with an 08 4.7 liter

Quote:

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Originally Posted by 07JeepXK

So it must be something new in 08+ Would still like to hear from someone with an 08 4.7 liter

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We might have to find an 08 for sale and take it for a test drive...

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I think Steve's is an 08....(mrnavy)

Mine is the same I have to hold the button down for full off. I don't run like that because it allows to much wheel spin for my needs since I mostly just rock crawl my XK. Once and a while when the sand is thick at the beach I hold the button down for some more wheel spin but thats about it.

When off road I run mine with ESP full-off (requires holding down the button on my '06 whether in 4Hi or 4Lo). I don't like the ABS coming on when on washboard or cornering through the bumps. It also seems to work better on the dunes when turned off.

As soon as I engage low range the ESP is fully off in mine. QDII 2007.

It must be something they started in late production 07+.. I will start trying both ways and see what the difference is. My guess is in sticky situations like mud/sand the ESP off will perform better but wondering if rock crawling scenarios are better with ESP partially on...?

I've always ran at Rausch Creek with it fully off and before the tcase issues never had a problem making it down any trail or hill climb.

Ill try it with ESP OFF and see what happens