Stone Soup Doc's New Project

I know that this is not a Jeep Commander project. It is in the off topic section and you might find it interesting and possibly give Doc and myself some feedback and new ideas.

Doc is going to put on his "Foose" hat and "Overhaul" my Mustang GT Convertable bracket race car. It still has the original white paint and sailcloth black top. I am happy with the mechanicals basically, but it need a new updated look.

Here are some pictures of the Mustang

https://theultimatejeep.com/images/i...IMG_1913-1.jpg

https://theultimatejeep.com/images/i...IMG_1914-1.jpg

https://theultimatejeep.com/images/i...MG_19151-1.jpg

https://theultimatejeep.com/images/i...IMG_1912-1.jpg

https://theultimatejeep.com/images/i...IMG_1916-1.jpg

Some of the initial thoughts are to paint it a bright metallic blue with white stripes and reverse lettering. To color match the mirrors with black edging and to color match the inside sections of the Prime wheels leaving the mag colored outer rims. The top will be replaced with the same soft black material. I imagine that Doc will post some pictures as he gets more creative than me.

Give us your ideas and suggestions, he is just starting and we can change the plan if we get good ideas.

Film at eleven.

The drivetrain consist of a SVT Motorsports factory Ford racing crate motor with GT40 heads and a B-303 cam. It has MAC shorty headers, an offroad "H" pipe, no cats and flowmaster mufflers with the early mustang rear exit pipes. The transmission is a 5 speed with a racing clutch and the rear gears have been changed from the factory 2:73 ratio to 3:73 posi

With a fresh clutch it runs in the high 13's. I try not to get below 14 seconds on a NHRA track because they require a roll bar if a convertable runs the quarter is less than 14 seconds.

It is a fun car to bracket race with and once it is "Overhauled" we will have a race night for anyone near Phoenix to take turns for low E.T.

As one who has driven this ride before I can tell you it is a blast and I look forward to hitting the track with it in the near future.

You didn't mention anything about your brake system. Everyone seems to be able to make lots of HP these days, races are one on the brakes IMO.

Thanks for the comments and give us some more input.

Doc and I talked about maybe installing Wildwood disc's all around. I mostly will only use this car on the dragstrip. It has disc's on the front and drums on the rear. I actually like the current setup because I can hold the car for burnouts with the foot brake because the disc's hold and the drums allow the engine to overcome the rear brakes for burnouts. Stopping at the end of the quarter mile is not to hard because of the slowdown area after the quarter mile. I agree that if I were doing road course racing or even street use it would be better to have bigger disc's all around. I could install a line lock for the front brakes but I am used to the way it is now.

I agree if it's staying on the strip then what you have is good and not worth up grading. As far as looks are concerned I would loose that luggage rack on the trunk and maybe put a low profile wing on. I would also loose those louver rear tail lights very late 80's or early 90's look. Some LED tail lights maybe clear lenses or something. Same goes with the front the bra and front head lights. I would also just put the roll bar in while you're doing all that work. I would also attack the car and drop everything I could saving weight. I think done properly a rear seat delete can look real cool on mustangs I was planning mine when I sold my mustang. Don't underestimate how much upgraded tail and head lights can change the look of a car. Thats all I got for now good luck bro

Thanks Sal. I agree about removing the luggage rack. Here are some head and tail lights that might look good

http://www.americanmuscle.com/black-...okit-8793.html

Hood

http://www.americanmuscle.com/kaenen-cowlhood-8793.html

Spoiler

http://www.americanmuscle.com/cervin...wing-7993.html

White insert letters

http://www.americanmuscle.com/8793-s...r-inserts.html

White stripes

http://www.americanmuscle.com/lemans...white-8in.html

Rear seat delete kit

http://www.americanmuscle.com/conver...lete-gray.html

i'm well versed in drag racing...

this is my 67 vw sedan daily driver i built a few years ago. all steel (no fibreglass fenders or hoods), naturally aspirated motor built on a stock vw engine case, full interior - door panels, carpet kit and a stereo in the dash - it never had a back seat though, it wasn't there when i bought it and nobody really fits in the back of a bug. anyway, on 6" slicks i was running 11.90 sec @ 110mph 1/4 mile. i embarassed a few high dollar cars. first rule to racing is never line up against a VW... if you win = "big deal, it was just a bug"... if you lose = "YOU GOT YOUR A$$ KICKED BY A VOLKSWAGEN!!!". 'nuff said.

https://theultimatejeep.com/images/i...03/bugRF-1.jpg

2165cc w/ 308* cam & about .670" lift at the valve. heads flowed 240cfm. 1.75" headers with 3" exhaust

https://theultimatejeep.com/images/i...3/bugeng-1.jpg

Irwindale track (california) 7.49 sec @ 89mph in 3rd gear

https://theultimatejeep.com/images/i...3/hangin-1.jpg

enough about me... let's talk about the 'stang.

if it were mine...
4" douglas style light weight rims up front with 165/15 tires (don't worry, it will still stop fine)
10" douglas rims out back with 30x10 slicks
get another set of 8" rear wheels to run street tires... 225/70 or so would be good
electric line lock up front so you don't get your rear brakes hot in the water box

MSD 6AL w/ a 3 step limiter - one overall limiter, one connected to the line lock so you don't over rev in the water box & one for a staging control.
you can preload the drivetrain with the parking brake when you stage, but i much prefer to rip that out and put a small hydraulic brake handle there (like a dunebuggy cutting brake)

move the exhaust up a bit for more ground clearance & dump the exhaust in front of the rear axle. the pipes out the back look cool but limit power with the standard muffler bends (that kink the pipes a bit and choke it down). long exhaust pipes are good for torque but this is good in that department. if you want to keep the pipes out the back i would go to a mandrel bent set up to eliminate restriction.

underdrive pulley for the motor & accesories... "free" horsepower. if it has a standard fan w/ fan clutch on the waterpump drive, i would go to an electric "puller" fan... more free horsepower.

build a REAL cold air intake... a gauze air filter is ok for less restriction but once that motor warms up the air you are pulling from inside the engine bay is less dense than the air flowing under the front air dam.

lower it about 2" all the way around.

i wouldn't worry about the brakes honestly. i ran my car with drums all the way around & only ran into the net at the top of the track once... and it was all my fault. we were screwing around at the track when an event got cancelled so we decided to show off and do wheelies (that thing would wheelie so hard it would be on one rear wheel and the muffler). we had loosened up the shocks so much that when i hit the brakes it was "dribbling" the front wheels and wouldn't stop... lol. not a hard hit, just a bit of a slide.

80/20 shocks up front (20% dampening extending, 80% dampening contracting). it will allow the front end to lift quickly when you launch for maximum weight transfer to the rear wheel, but will dampen it as it goes down to avoid a real bouncy and unpredictable ride. once you come out of the groove you're gonna hit the wall.

50/50 shocks in the rear with adjustable bumpstops to limit travel of the rear end when launching. the more it travels will affect your launch as the suspension will absorb the power & it will also keep it more stable on the track.

body work-

ditch the luggage rack on the trunk... don't worry about a wing on a car that's just dipping into 13's, they look cool but usually harm the aerodynamics more than they help. i didn't need a wing on my car until i got deep in the 12's... it would get real squirelly at the top of the track when i was coming off the throttle.

stock standard tail lights instead of the GT style "louvered" type. clear corners look OK on hondas but kinda silly on the older stylecars like the 'stang... jmho.

interior -

this is a true door slammer, but what nobody knows will give you the advantage

pull EVERYTHING out then strip as much as you can. remove all the tar paper and spray crap from the floor & inner body panels. anything that is double walled around the body can be lightened with a holesaw and still remain structurally sound.

when the interior goes back together buy the CHEAPEST items available. "cheap" is not a word that we use at my shop except in cases like this. the cheap interior door panels & carpet kit items are usually much thinner than OEM. thinner = lighter & lighter = faster.

every 100lbs you lose will net you about .10 (one tenth) of a second.

spare tire? don't need it
trunk carpet kit? don't need it... use a thin coat of bed liner or xolatone.

replace all glass with MR10 lexan except for the windshield. it looks just like glass and saves a lot of weight. your windows will still roll up and down, no problem. ditch the electric window motors and get standard roll up window crank mechanisms.

all the parts in the link look cool except for the rear delete I don't like it. My plan was to make one out of fiberglass and have it contour to the front seats and join the center counsel almost like a how they are in a vette. Adds weight but like the wing its the cool factor. If you're staying above 13 second car then you can afford to add the cool factor. I also don't see any disturbance from a wing bothering a 13 car to much at all once you break that 10 second mark you have to start worrying a little bit about that stuff. All my drag experience is on a bike by the way I never ran my mustang down the track I just drove it the track to watch then run my bike. I agree with doc I would dump everything out of it and save some weight but try to add some cool factor to the ride.

I have to agree with the boys, if this is purely going to be a toy from here on out I would get rid of everything not needed and cut the weight down as much as possible. skip the spoiler it is cool looking but will not help you go any faster.

Doc,

I am sure that all of your suggestions for lowering the ET are valid. However my goal is to basically freshen up the car cosmetically. It already has the ability to go quicker than allowed by the NHRA for a convertable without a roll bar. I could put in a roll bar but it would take away from the sleeper image. I get plenty of fun out of running it as it is mechanically. By the way it does have an underdrive pulley already. Most of the modification in the past have been geared towards making it reliable as a bracket car. It never breaks down, it just eats clutches and slicks, (sacraficial items anyway). Ask Jon about that. I like the idea of allowing other old geezers like me to tear up the track and not worry about blowing up the car.

Rather than putting all the work and cost into lightening the interior and glass, I would concentrate on making the interior Pop with new panels, seats, sound system, and trim. I do plan on mostly using it for the track, but I want to license it for the street also. I kinda like the idea of racing a door slammer with power windows.

Lowering it sound good but I already am a little lower than stock with the wide tires and I sometimes drag the botton putting it on the trailer.

Personally I like the tinted rear light in the link as long as they are legal. I had a trooper in Vermont make me remove the dark covers that I had on at one time.

I guess that I would say that the bottom line is that I want to get it back to head turning appearence and I am fine with the current performance.

By the way, in bracket racing I have had my clock cleaned by station wagons that run a 20 second ET but that cut a good light and exactly run their dial in.

Anybody that wants to chime in with any other ideas, feel free. Nothing is in stone yet, even though it is at the Stone Soup Shop.

Jon,

Every 1/10 of a second gets more expensive than the last 1/10th of a second. If I spent enough money, time, and energy cutting the weight and adding a blower or nitrous I am sure I could cut the ET down into the 12's or lower. If I did that I would have to add a serious roll bar/cage and I would not be as comfortable with old guys with minimal drag racing experience driving the car. The idea is to have fun, not to get anyone hurt. I want the old guys to get a rush, not to rush them to a hospital.

Sal,

I agree that a covered and closed back seat area would look better. However, since no one has sat in the back seat for years and probably never will, I like the idea of cleaning up the area by removing the seat and putting in the gray carpeting and simplifying the interior. I would even use the weight savings to add some good speakers.

Keep the ideas coming.

The rear seat cowl I'm talking about would look awesome and give you a great place to put speakers. I was going to have it professionally painted then air brushed with some graphics like mustang or something the possibilities are endless. I took the design cue from the super cars how it comes forward and hugs the front seats and flows to the dash. I wish I could draw so I could show you right now it's stuck in my head. I think you're on the right path with the lights and stuff it will look good when I up graded my head light I loved it.

Not what I was thinking but there not bad. I might play with the photo shop and see if I can draw something up.

https://theultimatejeep.com/images/i...ear_seat-1.jpg
https://theultimatejeep.com/images/i...nes_2005-1.jpg

I like the second one better. I am afraid that I might drop something on the speakers in the first one. I also like the idea of a cover to seal off the area, kind of like a tonneau cover on a wrangler or the rear seat area covers on old Thunderbirds

Ok this is a hack job but only had 5 minuets 0430 comes real fast :( It kinda shows what I was thinking I'll tinker with it more tomorrow maybe. Tell me what your thoughts are.
https://theultimatejeep.com/images/i...r20seat1-1.jpg

In Arizona anything other than stock tail lights is actually illegal. You are not supposed to add any tint or cover of any kind according to the statute.

If the tint is out, I would just as soon have the GT tail lights and maybe fit them with internal LEDs, possibly sequential LEDs. They also make Halo headlights for the Mustang.

Update:

Doc has had the Mustang at his shop and is tearing into it. His buddy the painter wants to get a little wild, (not sure what that means). He is going to sign it so I guess it cannot be that bad as it will reflect his skills on their web site.

Picked out the color. It is going to be the metallic blue color that looks bright blue in the sunlight and looks darker in shade. I think doc said that he is going to shoot a pearl base coat under it. The accents will be in white, Letters, stripes, air brushed logos.

He also mentioned paint matching the mirrors in blue with a black trim on the edges and painting the center and spokes on the wheels and leaving the rims shiny.

We also deceided to put a four point roll bar in and painting it either blue or probably black. This will eliminate my need to not break into the 13's when running on a NHRA track. This might be a slippery slope if we start adding NO2 or a blower.

I think Doc is taking progress pictures but I am not bugging him and he might want hold off on the pictures till it is finished. The past week has been prep and body work. Doc plans on shooting the fenders and such off the car but hanging in place to get the shading and paint the same. He or his guys are also pulling the doors and the interior panels to shoot the color on the edges and panels.

We did also agree to lose the luggage rack and spoiler and to never reinstall the front cover...lol.

Film at eleven...or if and when Doc chooses to share.

sounds like it's going to be a nice ride. I'm glad you decided to put the roll cage in smart move IMO

I don't care what it looks like, I just want it to go fast :)

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Knappster

I don't care what it looks like, I just want it to go fast :)

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ok Ricky Bobby LMAO

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Doc in AZ

i'm well versed in drag racing...

this is my 67 vw sedan daily driver i built a few years ago. all steel (no fibreglass fenders or hoods), naturally aspirated motor built on a stock vw engine case, full interior - door panels, carpet kit and a stereo in the dash - it never had a back seat though, it wasn't there when i bought it and nobody really fits in the back of a bug. anyway, on 6" slicks i was running 11.90 sec @ 110mph 1/4 mile. i embarassed a few high dollar cars. first rule to racing is never line up against a VW... if you win = "big deal, it was just a bug"... if you lose = "YOU GOT YOUR A$$ KICKED BY A VOLKSWAGEN!!!". 'nuff said.

https://theultimatejeep.com/images/i...03/bugRF-1.jpg

2165cc w/ 308* cam & about .670" lift at the valve. heads flowed 240cfm. 1.75" headers with 3" exhaust

https://theultimatejeep.com/images/i...3/bugeng-1.jpg

Irwindale track (california) 7.49 sec @ 89mph in 3rd gear

https://theultimatejeep.com/images/i...3/hangin-1.jpg

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Nice bug! I have a '65 RHD project that has been on the back burner for too long. 2276 FI in the works but it'll be a street car with full weight.


I like these older Mustangs, don't really care for the new ones of today. Keep us posted.

OK. Tomorrow is the day I am supposed to get my Mustang back. Doc thinks it will be ready. He has had it for a month and his buddy the painter said he was going to go a little wild. Will see tomorrow. I do know it will have a color matched roll bar.

I am posting to see if we have anyone other than Jon, Doc and me that want to take it to the track next Friday or Saturday night for the open test and tune runs.

The track is northwest of Phoenix

Click here: Welcome to Speedworld Dragstrip

They open at 6:00 pm. They have open runs on both Friday and Saturday nights.

Same deal as before, just pay to race, ($20) and we take turns with the Mustang.

You can also race anything that you bring. You might want to get a base line run with your Commander for future comparision.

Jon and I were going to go tomorrow night but we are not sure that Doc will be finished.

If you want to go, this would be a good time, because Lee and I are thinking of going up to Show Low for nicer, (cooler) weather in the pines.
__________________

Cool can't wait to see the pictures!

I have to go to Tuscon in the morning but plan to be back in time for the races if all goes as planned.

Either Doc and James are doing the world's best paint job or my mustang was a lot harder to work on than they thought. They still have it and I am having a hard time waiting to see it. I asked Jon (49er) to conduct a spy mission when he was over there, but he only saw the back end and some masking paper. I did manage to get the car registered for the next five years, However that was another "Black Operation" that I will not discuss. Lee and I are back in Phoenix. She found out that she has to have a total hip replacement. The summer of travel that we had started out on will have to be put on hold. she will need lot's of physical therapy following the surgery.

I do have lots of confidence in James and Doc's ability and I am sure the paint job will be worth the wait. Film at Eleven.

Picked up my old Mustang Monday. It does not look old anymore. I really like the color. It changes in light and shadow. I especially like the air brush badges on both front fenders. There is a close up in the pictures. Amazing art work by James the painter. I also really like the job Doc did with the roll bar. I am and will be detailing the entire car for the white residue from all the color buffing, but I am happy to do that. That just takes time and patience. My grandson Devin is here to help with Lee's recovery and he is helping me also.

https://theultimatejeep.com/images/i...06/01017-1.jpg
https://theultimatejeep.com/images/i...06/00915-1.jpg
https://theultimatejeep.com/images/i...06/00819-1.jpg
https://theultimatejeep.com/images/i...06/00721-1.jpg
https://theultimatejeep.com/images/i...06/00623-1.jpg
https://theultimatejeep.com/images/i...06/00522-1.jpg
https://theultimatejeep.com/images/i...06/00426-1.jpg
https://theultimatejeep.com/images/i...06/00331-1.jpg
https://theultimatejeep.com/images/i...06/00135-1.jpg

Sharp wheels too, do you have a list of everything, or most things, that were done?

Is it me or is the front bumper a darker shade?

I like the color, looks like they did an excellent job.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by HueyPilotVN

I really like the color. It changes in light and shadow.

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That's why you saw the difference.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Tymac

That's why you saw the difference.

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Guess I missed that, LOL.. thanks.

That is one fine looking ride, I would love to run it down the track!

OK Tomorrow night is the last Friday night test n tune till Summer, (like summer is not already here, 111 today). There will still be Wednesday night drags and Saturday night drags. Who wants to break in the new paint job. Just so you realize, tomorrow night is Friday night. If we get at least a couple of guys I will take the Motor coach over for a cool air conditioned refuge.

I have my grandson and he need some instruction in drag racing.

Here is the link for the dragstrip:

http://www.speedworlddragstrip.com/index.php

hey can you send some heat this way? The high today was 63 & we want some sun here tooo. I wish I was in AZ would love to watch that hit the track.

I would love to run tomorrow but I start my summer vacation in the morning and am heading out to Pasadena.